The spelling of Eric Suen's name . . .

[Brian Thibodeau]

Posted this in Actor Identification, but was advised it might be wise to put it here as well . . .

We have what I think is a very bizarre transliteration of Eric Suen's Chinese name in the database:

http://hkmdb.com/db/people/view.mhtml?i ... ay_set=eng

I'm admittedly no expert in these things but "Suen Yaw-Uei" seems like a ridiculous way to spell out his name. He doesn't spell it that way himself, either. Take a look at his blog at AliveNotDead:

http://www.alivenotdead.com/ericsuen/bl ... all_page_2

Scroll to the end of the first entry on the page above and you'll see he spells it Sun Yao-wai. I've added this as an alias to his entry, for now. Since he's commonly known (in English, at least), as Eric Suen (as in the title of his blog), I believe we should chance the main DB name to Eric Suen Yao-wai and ditch this strange looking "Yaw-Uei" business.

A search of "-uei" only returns Suen's listing. A search of "Yaw-" only brings up entries for Suen and Richard Wang Yaw-Chinq, someone who appears to have TWO bizarre mispellings in his name: "Yaw" and "Chinq" (with a "Q", which actually sounds kind of offensive).
http://hkmdb.com/db/people/view.mhtml?i ... ay_set=eng

Make the "Yaw"s into "Yao"s and the "Chinq" into "Ching" perhaps?

[dleedlee]

I think Sun Yao-Wei is the Mandarin version while Suen Yiu-Wai would be the Cantonese.
Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Eric-Suen ... 9672122229

Richard Wong / Wang Yao-Qing (M), Wong Yiu-HIng (C), or David Wang according to wikipedia. As he's from Taiwan, the Wades-Giles could be Wang Yao-Ch'ing, so Wang Yao-Ching works.

If this is the same person:
http://translate.googleusercontent.com/ ... hLt_v8c4pg

Looks like Richard Wang Yaw-Chinq comes from the HKFA entry!

[Brian Thibodeau]

I think Sun Yao-Wei is the Mandarin version while Suen Yiu-Wai would be the Cantonese.
Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Eric-Suen ... 9672122229

Nice find. A little searching shows me that Suen's entry was a thorn in my side as far back as 2007, when I provided caps for the FREAKING SPICY KILLER entry (http://hkmdb.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=46396). Back then, Suen was in the DB as "Eric Sung" (can't remember if the "Yaw-Uei" was present then). So, one more fix and we should finally give this chap his due.

I'm torn on how to display his "names" though. All of his albums/posters say "Eric Suen" when they show his name in English, but his movies (the main reason he's here) are a mish-mash favouring Taiwan and Mainland China. In TEAM OF MIRACLE and FREAKING SPICY he's definitely billed as Eric Suen. Perhaps since that's the more commonly used English spelling, his Cantonese name should be the main one, i.e. "Eric Suen Yiu-Wai", with Sun Yao-wei as the alias/Mandarin pronunciation?

Thoughts?

Richard Wong / Wang Yao-Qing (M), Wong Yiu-HIng (C), or David Wang according to wikipedia. As he's from Taiwan, the Wades-Giles could be Wang Yao-Ch'ing, so Wang Yao-Ching works.

Agreed. Since all of the movies in his filmography are Taiwanese, my vote is for:

Main: Richard Wang Yao-Ching
Alias: Wong Yiu-Hing (which is already there, but could also be added to the "Cantonese pronunciation" slot?)

Looks like Richard Wang Yaw-Chinq comes from the HKFA entry!

Interesting . . .

[dleedlee]

but could also be added to the "Cantonese pronunciation" slot?)

Aargh! Spelling and pronunciation are two different things. The Cantonese pronunciation would be Syun1 Yiu6 Wai1, including tones. How would you pronounce Thomas? In a similar vein, an alias should be a name that someone is also 'known as' , not an alternate pronunciation. Is Zhang Yimou's alias really Cheung Au-Mau, or is it simply a pronunciation of his name is a different dialect? Is even Zhang Yi-Mou an alias? Yes, a major burr under my saddle. A losing battle, I know.

[Brian Thibodeau]

You've misread me, but I take the blame, as I don't know what to call the various "fields" we have here for entering information, and I don't always know when someone's posting a spelling versus a pronunciation. I an, however, aware that spelling and pronunciation are two different things.

My first point was just that on the English page for Eric Suen, we have to have a main name for him. I say it should be Eric Suen Yiu-wai, spelled just like that.

My second point is pretty much this:

The Cantonese pronunciation would be Syun1 Yiu6 Wai1

This is exactly what I was referring to in my previous post, actually. I just didn't realize you hadn't provided it yet. That's the pronunciation, but you spelled it using English characters. Two different things, obviously, combined to aid the non-native speaker. Whenever I bring it up, that's what I'm referring to, no matter how my poor wording may make it sound. Didn't realize the names you typed earlier weren't "pronounced" versions.

Underneath the main name in the DB, on many actors in the DB (such as this one: http://hkmdb.com/db/people/view.mhtml?i ... ay_set=eng), there's this really vaguely named "field" that simply says "Cantonese:" (as in, Cantonese what?). That's real helpful to the unitiated, and probably one of the myriad things that are wrong with this site, but most of us here understand what it is. Anyways, in there, we put the Cantonese pronunciations spelled out in English (as in "Syun1 Yiu6 Wai1"). At least, this is what I've always assumed those fields to be for. Someone more enlightened (like you!) can decide (or prove) how Suen's Cantonese pronunication should be spelled out in English for that field, just as you've already done.

UNDER THERE, we have the equally vague field called "Mandarin:" which would get the Mandarin pronunication in English letters.

That's all I was referring to. Apologies if it looks like I'm being ignorant of Chinese names/sounds/pronunciations etc. I'm not. My comments above about putting various names into the Cantonese and Mandarin fields were simply based on my misunderstanding that the names you typed above might have been pronunciations. Fine if they're not, and if they've never appeared anywhere as alternate English spellings then they should not appear on the entry, correct?

I don't enter information into those two fields because I know I'd be asking for trouble. It's obviously not an area of specialty. I DO, however, enter information into the "Alias" fields all the time, but only when I find alternate English spellings of names, such as Eric Suen's at his own Alive Not Dead blog (and now Facebook, thanks to your detective work). That's precisely the kind of thing an English speaker might enter into a search box here after visiting his blog. Now it will get him/her somewhere.

[Brian Thibodeau]

By the way, the Zhang Yimou thing: I don't know why that "Cheung Au-Mau" is there when the Cantonese pronunciation (which nearly looks the same, only with the extra "a") is right there above it. I don't recall ever having seen him credited on screen in English as Cheung Au-Mau. Mind you, though, I haven't seen all of his pictures. Still, I have strong doubts it should be there as I've long believed the "alias" field to be for the exact purpose you already stated, and that's how I use it.

[dleedlee]

Sorry, didn't mean to direct my ire specifically at you. It's just that the topic, as you know, is my major irritation about the db. Yes, the Cantonese/Mandarin labels are confusingly unclear. But based on the original db entries, my interpretation of the designer's (Ryan Law's ?) intent was that these are pronunciation fields and I've always followed that as my guide. The Alias field, in my mind (but, apparently, not all editors) are for alternate English written names that at one point were actually used. The double vowel names issue, e.g., Saan,Mooi,Pooi, are directly related to writing names as pronounced, no doubt.

Both primary names changed.
Perhaps the Chinq was a typo on HKFA's part?

[Brian Thibodeau]

Sorry, didn't mean to direct my ire specifically at you. It's just that the topic, as you know, is my major irritation about the db. Yes, the Cantonese/Mandarin labels are confusingly unclear. But based on the original db entries, my interpretation of the designer's (Ryan Law's ?) intent was that these are pronunciation fields and I've always followed that as my guide. The Alias field, in my mind (but, apparently, not all editors) are for alternate English written names that at one point were actually used. The double vowel names issue, e.g., Saan,Mooi,Pooi, are directly related to writing names as pronounced, no doubt.

Your interpretation of those labels/fields is the same as mine. In fact, it's a bummer they haven't continued to be added over the years. There are a lot of people in the DB with neither pronunciation under their names.

Those double-vowel spellings drive me nuts. I've fixed a few of these (where possible, and verifiable) over the years, but I guess at this point, we'd almost need some kind of "style guide" to properly change them all.

Perhaps the Chinq was a typo on HKFA's part?

One of those things that gets duplicated around the web, no doubt. It's probably a good thing he has a relatively small resume and is probably rarely mentioned in reviews of his films.

[calros]

A search of "-uei" only returns Suen's listing. A search of "Yaw-" only brings up entries for Suen and Richard Wang Yaw-Chinq, someone who appears to have TWO bizarre mispellings in his name: "Yaw" and "Chinq" (with a "Q", which actually sounds kind of offensive).
http://hkmdb.com/db/people/view.mhtml?i ... ay_set=eng

I created this name. Taiwanese romanizations are bizarre but we must respect them.

[Brian Thibodeau]

I created this name. Taiwanese romanizations are bizarre but we must respect them.

I have no problem with the "Chinq" remaining in the DB, but I just don't think it should be the primary name, even based on your evidence. I don't think it's a peculiar Taiwanese romanization; I think it's a simple Taiwanese spelling mistake by whoever typed those credits. As such, it definitely belongs in the DB, as someone could very well search his name using that spelling some day. I searched the Chinese character, though, and it brings back lots of Hings, Chings and Qings, but no Chinqs (well, except this guy, of course).